Address
by NATO Acting Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge at the NATO Parliamentary Assembly followed by Q&A
(as delivered)
Mr. Vice President, honourable members of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly (NPA), ladies and gentlemen,
In his statement, Secretary General Rutte set out the challenges confronting our Alliance and identified what we need to do going forward.
He was hoping to be here today, and very much regrets he is unable to be present.
Keep in mind that he is still in month two of his tenure, although probably it seems a lot longer to him than that.
But next year's NPA anniversary meeting in Dayton, Ohio is already in his calendar.
And he is eager to work with all of you in the NPA.
As for myself, I'm honoured to replace him at this important session. Let me also say that our best wishes go out to NPA president, Gerry Connolly.
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I would like to start by thanking Canada for hosting us in beautiful Montreal.
A founding member of NATO, Canada was one of the first to propose the idea of a transatlantic defensive alliance.
From the beginning, Canada argued that NATO should be more than just a military pact and advocated for strong political and economic ties across the Alliance.
This is reflected in Article Two of the North Atlantic Treaty, sometimes referred to as “the Canadian Article.”
And the NATO Parliamentary Assembly can be characterised as one of those “free institutions” referred to in Article Two.
You are democracy in action.
And it’s impressive to see all of you gathered here today:
200 members of parliament from 32 Allied nations. Alongside 50 members from partner countries and the European Parliament.
On behalf of the Secretary General, I want to thank you all for reinforcing the principles, values, and ideals that underpin our Alliance.
You represent different political parties, hold diverse political views, and work in distinct political systems.
But together in the NPA you stand on common ground, building mutual understanding and strengthening transatlantic cooperation.
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2024 has been a historic year for NATO:
Sweden joined the Alliance.
We marked 75 years of NATO.
We bid farewell to one Secretary General,
and welcomed another.
We took decisions at the Washington Summit to safeguard our security.
By strengthening our deterrence and defence.
By committing to support Ukraine.
And by deepening our partnerships around the world.
This meeting of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly comes at a critical time for our security.
Russia’s brutal assault against Ukraine and its people continues unrelenting.
And Moscow is increasingly relying on China, Iran and North Korea to prop up its economy and its war of aggression.
Not content with providing Russia with ammunition and ballistic missiles, North Korea is now sending troops to fight against Ukraine.
This is an extremely dangerous development and an expansion of the war.
And if you want talk about escalation, you have escalation right there.
In return, Russia is providing North Korea with missile technology, threatening not only Indo-Pacific but also Euro-Atlantic security.
Shahed drones supplied by Iran are killing and wounding Ukrainian men, women, and children every day.
Meanwhile China has turned itself into a decisive enabler of Russia’s war.
It is fuelling Russia’s war machine with components for weapons, equipment, and raw materials.
As these countries align to weaken us, NATO must continue:
To stand strong.
To stand by Ukraine.
And to stand up for the rules-based international order with our partners around the world.
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When it comes to our support for Ukraine, NATO Allies are living up to the pledge of providing 40 billion Euros per year as baseline military support.
And the NATO Command for Security Assistance and Training for Ukraine, also known as NSATU, will soon be fully operational.
But to change the trajectory of the conflict, and to create the conditions to end the conflict, we need to do even more.
The stronger Ukraine is on the battlefield, the stronger they will be at the negotiating table and the greater the chances of achieving a just and lasting peace.
And achieving that is in our strategic interest because Ukraine’s long-term security is our security.
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As an Alliance, our first order of business is to maintain credible deterrence and defence.
As the Secretary General said, that means spending more on defence and strengthening our defence industrial base.
23 NATO Allies are now spending at least 2% of GDP on defence.
That's the good news.
The bad news is that nine Allies are not yet there.
And the bad news is that 2% is not enough to resource the defence plans that our leaders have adopted together.
So Allies must indeed step up, spend more and spend better.
And those that are lagging in terms of defence spending need to work even harder to catch up.
Given a supremely challenging environment, we can no longer afford delays.
For many years, US administrations, Democratic and Republican, have called for Allies to take on their fair share of the burden.
But it took Russia's invasion of Ukraine to bring about a sea change.
And it was also thanks to tough messages by President-elect Trump, that European Allies stepped up.
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As parliamentarians, you know better than anyone that increasing defence spending is hard.
We know there will be difficult debates when it comes to adopting budgets and allocating more funding for defence.
But security is the foundation of prosperity. There is simply no alternative if we wish to maintain our freedom and our way of life.
As parliamentarians, it is you interacting with constituents and making the case; it is you shaping and adopting budgets, and that makes all the difference.
At the end of the day, it's about leadership.
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Since 1949, North America and Europe have been stronger and safer together.
A strong transatlantic bond remains indispensable in this age of uncertainty.
As we approach the end of NATO’s 75th anniversary year, we should reflect on what this great Alliance has achieved.
And we must summon the resolve to meet the challenges ahead.
Next year will be the NPA’s 70th anniversary. It will be an opportunity to highlight your work in the service of democracy.
A champion of transatlantic democracy and of NATO was Lester Pearson, one of the architects of the North Atlantic Treaty and later Canada’s Prime Minister.
When he signed the treaty for Canada in 1949 he said, “this Treaty is not a pact for war, but a pledge for peace and progress.”
Today, all of us have a solemn duty to honour that pledge.
And that means:
To prevent war.
To keep our 1 billion citizens safe.
And together to navigate a dangerous world.
Thank you very much for your attention, and I look forward to answering your questions. Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Mr Deputy Secretary General, Mr Ruge, I'm Theo Francken, and I'm from Belgium. I'm the Vice President. I'm going to chair this Q&A, we have a lot of questions. You have 90 seconds, and I will, I will be very severe on the timing, because there's a lot of people who wants to ask a question, and I think everybody deserves the chance to also ask his or her question. First of all, I will group them into three, and we'll start with the United States. Michael, Mr Michael Turner, head of the delegation and former president. Please, Mr Turner.
Michael Turner, Head of the Delegation of the United States of America
Thank you. We appreciate your comments. One issue that has been a continuous debate, I think, of all the delegations, has been the need for lessening the restrictions on the use for Ukraine of weapon systems that are being provided to Ukraine. The United States is beginning to lessen those restrictions. We're beginning to see some of the effects of those, the prior Secretary General was very articulate in encouraging member nations to doing so. We're certainly hoping that the current Secretary General continues that tradition of advocating for Ukraine to have that flexibility, knowing its importance.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Second question from Natalia Napouzyreff, from France, head of delegation, go ahead.
Natalia Napouzyreff, Head of the Delegation of France
Thank you, Mr Vice-President, the aggression Russia has mobilized NATO and led to a great mobilization from north to the south of the Alliance. And we're very happy that Finland and Sweden have joined the Alliance. Now, as to support for Ukraine, European contribution is quite comparable to what the United States are contributing. Obviously, we've had to restart our industrial base. It was dormant for too long. In 2024 we produced 1 million shells, and thanks to the Czech initiative, it'll be a total of 1.5 million shells that will be delivered to Ukraine this year. I would also mention the European initiative UMAM for the training of Ukrainian soldiers. So France has put up a platoon from one to the one into the other, and that is in Kyiv. Generally speaking, what's important is to harmonize the efforts between NATO and the European Union and the sharing of this burden between the members of the alliance. Mr Ruge, could you share your vision of the European pillar of the transatlantic security scenario? Thank you, sir.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. United Kingdom, head of the delegation, please. Mr Twigg.
Derek Twigg, Head of the Delegation of the United Kingdom
Thank you. The UK is proud to be one of the largest contributors to our personnel, to the NATO Security Assistance Training in Ukraine (NSATU). What more can the Allies be doing to achieve activation by early next year?
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
That was short. Thank you so much. I give the, please, I give the floor to Mr Ruge.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
That's it. Thank you very much, Mr Vice-President, to answer the first question from Mike Turner. Many thanks for this question. I think I can answer it in a very concise manner, and that is that Mark Rutte's position on this issue is the exact same as that put forward by Jens Stoltenberg. So Mark Rutte, since he has taken up the office of Secretary General, has also called on Allies to lift restrictions. It's a national decision on the part of Allies, but we have always made the point that Ukraine is engaged in an act of self-defence under Article 51 of the United Nations Charter. And Ukraine fighting is not limited to its own territory, because militarily, that's an impossibility. So Ukraine is entitled to strike targets inside the Russian Federation. And this Secretary General, as well as his predecessor, have repeatedly encouraged Allies to review those restrictions, to lift them or to relax them, so Ukraine can stay in the fight and deal with this Russian war of aggression. I hope that goes somewhere in answering the question.
Madam, the question on the European pillar. So, it is clear that European Allies must step up in terms of burden sharing in the Alliance, meaning our deterrence and defence, but also in terms of supporting Ukraine. It is true that European Allies and Canada have done a great deal, but it is also true that the United States of America has provided the single most important contribution to keep Ukraine in the fight. And, so, in both regards, our deterrence and defence and support to Ukraine, we need Europe to play an Even more important role. And the idea of European pillar, of course, is one that goes back many decades. I think it was first, first put forward as an idea in the 1960s. It is also a term that can be found in some NATO documents, although you will not find it in the Washington summit declaration of this year, but it is worth thinking about how we can strengthen Europeans, Europe's contribution. And when we talk about Europe, I think the Secretary General would highlight that Europe is not identical with the European Union, but that we must also keep in mind non-EU Allies, to include the United Kingdom, Türkiye, Norway and others who are very important Allies, who bring a great deal to the table in terms of military capabilities. So I think reflecting on that European pillar, what it could be, I think, is good, as long as it maintains our Transatlantic Alliance, as long as it brings on board non-EU Allies.
The question from the UK delegation, many thanks. SACEUR General Cavoli is working hard to bring about full operational capability of NSATU, NATO Security Assistance and Training for Ukraine before the end of the year, and I'm confident that is what we will see. DSACEUR, deputy Supreme Allied Commander, SACEUR himself, the Secretary General, have called on Allies to make the necessary contributions. We are on a good path, and we will get there. So before the end of the year, NSATU will be stood up, will be fully operational to assist Ukraine. And of course, as you may remember, what we have always said is that the transition from the existing structures to NSATU will happen when NSATU is able to deliver so that there is no lessening in terms of support to Ukraine. We cannot afford any kind of transit transition period during which Ukraine would receive less support than has been guaranteed by the structures in place. Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you for the answers. Three. The next three. Canada, Mrs Julie Dzerowicz, you have the floor. Please.
Julie Dzerowicz, Head of the Delegation of Canada
Thank you so much, Mr Vice-President, and I want to say a huge thanks to you, Acting Deputy Secretary General Ruge, for being here today and for your excellent speech. I particularly very much appreciated you mentioning Lester B. Pearson, former Prime Minister of Canada, and his role in helping to inaugurate NATO, and that he reminded us, NATO is not a path for war, but a pledge for peace and progress. So I really appreciate that. I have two quick questions for you both very important to us here in Canada. The first is that Ukraine's victory plan calls for an invitation for Ukraine to join NATO as its first of five points. I know that you have made a speech in Latvia very recently in October, and you emphasized that Ukraine is on an irreversible path to NATO membership.
So what kind of support is NATO providing to Ukraine and their reform efforts, and what are, what is required for them to, to, to join NATO in terms of an invitation. And then my last 20 seconds, Canada's put a major focus on the Arctic. And high north and Arctic NATO parliamentarians have gotten together here informally to make sure that we start putting, well, elevating the discussion and the knowledge around security and defence issues. So can you give us an idea of your assessment of the threats and to NATO and what we should be doing to address them? Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Julie. Then for Germany. Johan, head of delegation.
Johann Wadephul, Head of the Delegation of Germany
Thank you so much. I will speak in German, because we have a German guest here, would like to switch into my mother language. Mr Ruge, Thank you so much. This is where I'm sitting, by the way. Thank you so much for having us. Thank you for joining us, and thank you so much as well for having provided this highly qualified speech, and for the Q&A, for remaining available. But still, let me express my hope that we will be able to have the NATO SecGen as regular visitor as we use have had it, Mr Stoltenberg, rightly, attached great importance to having that exchange with parliamentarians on a regular basis. And you put it rightly, we're the ones that are adopting budgets at the end of the day, and to be honest, we're the ones within our own political parties and parliamentary groups have to win over other colleagues to spend more on NATO and to spend more on defence efforts.
And this is what my question is getting at you. You rightly pointed out that defence spending is largely diverging from one NATO state to another, and the gap is even larger between NATO defence plans and the contributions that are actively being made by many countries, and this gap is becoming wide and more and more critical to my mind. Do we have to correct the defence plans? Wouldn't we have to make the defence plans more transparent in order to point out really that we need to do more, provide more troops and materiel to be really deterrent? Thank you so much.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Next question from Poland, please, head of delegation, Joanna Kluzik-Rostkowska.
Joanna Kluzik-Rostkowska, Head of the Delegation of Poland
Thank you very much. I am the head of the Polish delegation, and as Ukraine's neighbours, we are uniquely positioned to recognize the treats from Russia and Belarus along with the Baltic countries, we play a key role in NATO's Eastern Flank, the region's security shifting and US plan to the Ukraine-Russia conflict remains unclear till now. This makes it crucial to ask the NATO new command, what is the plan to [inaudible] countries of the Eastern Flank. And the second, what are the possible scenarios for NATO's response to the threats we face? It's crucial to learn military lessons for this war. I am glad a NATO centre is being set up in Bydgoszcz, in Poland, to gather the information. To rebuild security in our region, we need strong support for Ukraine, unity against threats and to learn lessons from the front lines to ensure our armies and well prepared for modern challenges. Thanks.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Yes, thank you. Floor is yours, Mr Ruge.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Thank you, Mr Vice-President. First question from Canada, for which many thanks. Ukraine's victory plan, which indeed prominently features the issue of an invitation. Now, NATO's position is enshrined in the Washington summit declaration, where we talk about Ukraine's irreversible path to membership, where we repeat that Ukraine's future is at NATO, so that is where we are. An invitation has not been issued. It can only be issued on the basis of consensus among 32 Allies. But certainly President Zelenskyy has put this issue once again on the table for us to consider and for us to consider as part of our broader support to Ukraine. And it is clear that Ukraine currently is facing a very challenging situation on the front line, so we have to look at the sum total, and as 32 Allies, we have to keep our eye on the ball and reflect on which steps we can take. Now, actually, tomorrow, we will have a NATO-Ukraine Council at the request of Ukraine, to talk about the current situation after last week, last week's Russian attacks, specifically the attack on Dnipro. In terms of reforms, we have clear expectations from Ukraine. The vehicle for reforms is the adapted annual national program. It's a Ukrainian owned document, but it is prepared with our inputs, and it is reviewed by us, and that will happen at the foreign ministerial meeting on three and four December in Brussels. As for the high north and Arctic, indeed, a very dynamic area. And what is new here is that we have added Finland and Sweden, so now we have, I think it's seven out of eight Arctic countries as members of our Alliance. That's the good news. The bad news is that Russia is increasingly active, and China is increasingly active, up in the Arctic. So we have to have, take a hard look at this and see what our posture is and how we can address these new threats. And I can assure you that Ambassador Hulan is very much on the case at NATO.
To Johan Wadephul, absolutely, the Secretary General, would very much have liked to be here. He understands very well the importance of the NPA. You will see him at the anniversary meeting in Dayton, Ohio next year, and we will certainly convey the point you just made. You asked about the gap between capability requirements, capability targets, on the one hand, and the reality and whether there is a need to change the defence plans. And I think the logic, as we see it is a different one. Our leaders have decided on these defence plans. It is now our job to resource these defence plans. So logically, we have to take the next step in in terms of the NATO defence planning process and move forward. This will be very challenging. There's absolutely no doubt about that. It will not be possible in many cases, to meet those requirements, to meet those targets on the basis of 2% defence spending, that is something we also said in The Washington declaration. So we have our work cut out, I think all of us. Some nations are farther along and have increased defence spending. Some nations took less of a break from deterrence and defence than others. So we cannot, we cannot say it's the same picture across 32 Allies. That is definitely not the case. But we need to increase defence spending, and the job is to meet the requirements and the targets under the defence plans that we have adopted over the past two years.
To the question from the Polish head of delegation. Thank you very much for the question. Obviously, Allies on the eastern flank have been exposed in a particular way to the threats from Russia. That is true. I think the Alliance has stepped up and has increased our presence on the eastern flank in terms of forward land forces, in terms of, in terms of air policing, in terms of the rotational IND model. And you're quite right that the Joint Analysis, Training and Education Centre that will be created in Bydgoszcz in Poland as a joint NATO-Ukrainian organization that comes under Allied Command Transformation, that is an important addition to the picture, because we need to learn from our partners in Ukraine, who have shown an ability to learn and adapt, and to combine military capabilities with sort of cutting edge technology, and we can learn a lot from that as an Alliance. So thank you very much for the support Poland is providing in that regard. And I think that covers it.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
I think also. So we go further with Lithuania. Audronius Azubalis, the head of delegation of Lithuania, please.
Audronius Azubalis, Head of the Delegation of Lithuania
Thank you. Thank you. Mr Deputy Secretary General.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Maybe just when you start asking the question, maybe just raise the hand, because it's a really big room and we don't know where everybody is sitting. So thank you.
Audronius Azubalis, Head of the Delegation of Lithuania
Thank you, Mr Deputy Secretary General, what is your opinion of a new NATO leadership on training Ukrainian soldiers, on Ukrainian soil, soil. It would be quicker, and we know that the time is crucial now, and cheaper. Such idea was raised by the French President Macron and supported by many NATO countries, including mine, Lithuania. What else do we need to take bold actions? Because now we see the same de-escalation opinion prevailing. Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Next question from the Netherlands, head of delegation, Jesse Klaver, please. You have the floor.
Jesse Klaver, Head of the Delegation of the Netherlands
Thank you, Mr Vice-President, after the start of Russia's [inaudible] on February 24, 2022 Chancellor Olaf Scholz talked about the Zeitenwende, a historical turning point. A lot has happened since in Europe, more and more countries are meeting the goal of 2% GDP spending, including the Netherlands. But still, you can question, is this enough to coping the Zeitenwende in an effective way. Since the beginning of the war, we have seen massive use of missiles and drones by Russia, revealing considerable gaps in Europe's defence against aerial attacks. European NATO Allies seem to have understood that they can no longer outsource their air defence to Washington, and the million, million dollar question is how to counter the threat from Russian missiles, many of which can also deliver nuclear warheads.
A lot of political focus goes to missile defence as a solution. But it's said by experts that an extending, extending and effective missile shield over the entirety of NATO's European territory would be both technically infeasible and prohibitively expensive. To properly address the threat of Russia's missiles and deter broader conflict, it's said that the European NATO Allies need to complement defences, defensive systems with offensive ones. What are, in your opinion, the most important steps to take by European NATO Allies to defeat Russian aggression in the missile and drones, armed, drone arms race, with the potentially complication of minimal support of the United States. Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Yes, a great question. Then, Estonia, head of delegation, Raymond Kaljulaid. Raymond, please. Yes. If you dare, you have the floor.
Raymond Kaljulaid, Head of the Delegation of Estonia
Thank you very much. The issue of extending an Invitation to Ukraine has been front and centre in our proceedings here in Montreal. It has been raised by Ambassador Taylor, by speaker Stefan [inaudible]. It was discussed yesterday in the standing committee. So I have two questions regarding that. First of all, could you please explain the technical process so that we understand it, that when we have consensus and political decision by the Allies, what happens then, and how quickly can that invitation be extended to Ukraine?
And my second question on that is, when we ask about what is the reason some Allies are hesitant. We are often cited that it's fear of escalation. Could you please expand what on earth that would mean in the situation where we have Russia, including possibly tens of thousands of North Korean troops into the theatre, and using intermediate ballistic missiles, what more can they escalate? And what exactly is that fear of some of the Allies that maybe we can somehow address and alleviate those concerns that some partners have. Thank you very much.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Raymond Yes, Mr Ruge, you have the floor.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
First question from Lithuania. Training Ukrainian soldiers on Ukrainian soil, indeed that was a discussion that took place early this year. I believe it was February, late February, early March, including a meeting in Paris of a number of Allies. And, of course, you can make the case that training Ukrainian troops in Ukraine would be more effective. At the end of the day. Allies have opted not to do this. The European Union has opted not to do this, but to continue training outside of Ukraine. And I think one element to be kept in mind is that, in this situation. Individual Allies must always keep in mind that their actions may have implications for the Alliance as a whole. And I think that is probably an element that factored into the decision making, reflected in the status quo - That training continues outside of Ukraine rather than being moved into the country. The question from the Netherlands delegation. Many thanks for that. Air defence. Absolutely. A critical area, and an area in which, clearly, building the systems, deploying these systems, is a time consuming, very expensive, but it is definitely an area that merits our attention, and we must, of course, learn the lessons from the war in Ukraine.
And indeed you are right. And I don't think this is the right place to go into details, and perhaps it would be better to have military colleagues speak to this, but clearly, in order to address this, you need a mix of defensive systems and offensive systems, and I think that is a discussion. As we can see, in terms of statements by governments and debates, at the national level, that is a conversation that is already ongoing. To the question from the Estonian delegation, for which also many thanks, of course we have the recent experience of the accession of Finland and Sweden, so we and the international staff know very well how the process works. And you can break it down into probably nine or ten steps. But the first step is, of course, that there be consensus among 32 Allies to issue an invitation to Ukraine, and clearly, we are not at that point right now. When we reach that point, again, we have to go through a number of steps, some of which, again, require consensus. And again, if you look at the accession process as it played out for Sweden and Finland, that gives you an idea of the kind of time frame in which this can happen. Historically speaking, both accessions, including the accession of Sweden, were fairly rapid. There have been times when exception has taken more time.
Now, as to the issue of escalation, I think it is very important not to fall into the trap of rhetoric spread by Moscow and ideas spread by Moscow that it is NATO or that it is Ukraine that is escalating this conflict. Russia invaded Ukraine, violating. Fundamental principles of international law. First, in 2014, annexing part of Ukrainian territory, violating, not just, the norms of the United Nations Charter, but also the Budapest Memorandum in which they had guaranteed themselves the territorial integrity and sovereignty of Ukraine. And then, of course, we had the full scale invasion of February 2022.
And the notion that it is Ukraine or the west that have escalated are laughable. It is Russia that continuously has escalated. Ukraine is engaged in a war of self-defence, which is entirely legitimate and legal under article 51 of the UN Charter. Now, how that relates to invitation, I think that is a broader question, but I would insist on the fact that it is not Ukraine and it is not NATO that have escalated. It is escalation by the Russian Federation that is ongoing, and the most recent example of that is, of course, the deployment of North Korean troops, which I think few of us would have imagined just a few months ago.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. We continue with Croatia, Mr Dario Hrebak, head of delegation. Please, Mr Hrebak.
Dario Hrebak, Head of the Delegation of Croatia
Dear Mr Ruge, thank you once again for visiting Croatia a few weeks ago and help us explain the real essence of the EU-NATO mission. Russia's war against Ukraine has literally demonstrated that public opinion across NATO countries has been intentionally targeted with the goal of undermining our overall political cohesion and our common will to help Ukraine. NATO Strategic Communications efforts play a critical role in safeguarding our strategic resilience. Regarding this my question is, what is the current status of NATO PA's Initiative of establishing a formal structure within the NATO headquarters, commonly known as the center for democratic resilience. What kind of measures and activities are undertaken since Washington summit this year? I am asking this because The reality is that Russians and their proxies are currently winning the misinformation war in this hybrid domain. we see this, In effect, on a daily basis, in a lot of NATO countries. Thank you very much.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much, very good question. Then we have Lorenzo Cesa, Head of the Delegation of Italy. He will ask his question in Italian. So maybe you can put your headphones on, please, Lorenzo.
Lorenzo Cesa, Head of the Delegation of Italy
Thank you very much to you and thank you to Ambassador Ruge. The NATO Southern Neighbourhood includes North Africa, the Middle East and the Sahel Region. This neighbourhood is dealing with multiple interconnected challenges. These range from armed conflicts to terrorism, migration and, of course, Climate change. The Mediterranean can no longer be considered a peripheral area When it comes to the collective security of the Atlantic Alliance. And this is because of the internal tensions in the region, as well as external interference, which we are perfectly familiar with. Given that global stability is now an indivisible asset of us all, the Washington summit finally launched its action plan for the southern neighbourhood, and they've appointed a special representative who has gone to Egypt, Morocco and Jordan as well, Mr Colomina. So my question is, will they be establishing a liaison office of NATO in Aman. When, if so, and what will the specific tasks be for that office. And what are their aims going to be? It is important for NATO to strengthen the climate of trust and foster mutual knowledge and acquaintances with its Partners in the Mediterranean Dialogue and the Istanbul Cooperation Initiative? Now, to that purpose, do you think it might be useful for the individual member states to draw up national intervention plans in order to supplement the action plan launched in Washington?
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Next question is Patrício Oliveira, the Head of the Delegation of Portugal. Mr Oliveira, please, you have the floor.
Hugo Patrício Oliveira, Head of the Delegation of Portugal
Thank you Mr Vice President. Mr Ambassador, Acting Deputy Secretary General, thank you for your speech. Directly to the point, could I have your comments to the challenges and threats, but also the opportunities for NATO in the southern flank?
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Thank you, Mr Vice President, first to the question from the delegation of Croatia. Mr Hrebak, thank you once again for welcoming me in Zagreb. Not long ago, I was happy to accept the invitation coming from you and the Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee to speak to members of the Croatian Parliament about NSATU, our new Command to support Ukraine, and I hope that the points I could share with you and the questions that I addressed were helpful in your deliberations. Now you asked about the Centre for Democratic Resilience. It is a long standing initiative coming from the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, but I'll be I'll be quite straightforward. It is not an initiative that has the consensus among 32 Allies this has been, I believe, the situation for a number of years already, which is not to say that that the 32 ambassadors sitting around the table at NATO Headquarters don't believe that democratic resilience is important. They believe it's extremely important, and we have a whole series of work strands to address precisely those questions. At this point in time, I do not believe that that this initiative as a standalone unit in the international staff has the support to go forward, but the challenges that you mentioned, of course, are supremely important and are very much on our agenda.
As for the Southern Neighbourhood to address the question coming from the Italian Delegation, as well as the delegation of Portugal, indeed, based on the report of the expert group convened by Secretary General Stoltenberg, and the action plan that we put forward, we now have a new basis on which to work. The action plan was adopted in Washington. Javier Colomina was appointed as Special Representative for the Southern neighbourhood, and we have been very active even in the past weeks and months, among other things, we will very soon open the liaison office in Amman, Jordan. We have worked with a number of Allies. We have accepted the offer of Italy to host the NATO liaison office in its embassy in Amman, because that was upon very close analysis, the best offer. This is an office that will have as its task the cooperation with Jordan, which is a very important partner to NATO.
So it is not a regional task, it is a task of working with Jordan. I can share with you that we will have His Majesty, King Abdullah of Jordan, joining us for the Foreign Ministerial Meeting in December, to share with us his analysis of the situation in the region. And I think that will be very helpful in order to clarify some of these issues. But of course, we will also continue working through the NATO ICI Regional Centre in Kuwait, which does have a regional task. We will continue to be present in Iraq through the NATO mission in Iraq. And we will build our political dialog with Southern Neighbourhood partners, and we will try and do a better job in terms of defence capacity packages where we, I think, in the past, have not always delivered to the level that our partners would have liked to see. So we have our work cut out, and we are grateful to the support of individual Allies that is particularly relevant when it comes to defence capacity building. And what nations do here is extremely important, but we offer, I think, now, a platform with a special representative and with the action plan and with better coordination at NATO across the NATO enterprise that will hopefully allow us to do a better job of addressing the challenges and grasping the opportunities that exist in our Southern Neighbourhood.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
It's a bit disappointing to hear that after all those years of fighting for that centre of democratic resilience, that there's still no consensus within NATO to create one. So I hope that that will find a consensus as soon as possible in Brussels to have that centre. Latvia, Head of the Delegation Mr Raimonds Bergmanis, please, you have the floor.
Raimonds Bergmanis Head of the Delegation of Latvia
Dear Acting Deputy Secretary General, my question is about the importance of military mobility. Military mobility play a crucial role in sanctioning Europe's defence and deterrence capabilities, especially in the Eastern Europe, for example, in the Baltic States. It is not our fault that we have to live next door to unpredictable and dangerous Russia. Question: do you see any possibility for the Alliance to allocate some funding for partial financing of the development of such strategically important projects like, for example, railway rail Baltic? I have to admit that the [inaudible] in the Baltic states is different from main railway network in Europe, therefore my question is of utmost importance. Thank you.
NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. Very good question. Dimitrios Kairidis, from Greece.
Dimitrios Kairidis, Greek Delegation: Mr Chairman, I was partially covered by some of the questions and answers by my Italian and Croatian colleague. But allow me to insist a little bit on the Democratic resilience initiative that outgoing chairman of this assembly [inaudible] supported so much and our assembly has voted for time and again, and it was something that was discussed yesterday in the standing committee. Now Secretary General Mr Rutte is visiting Athens as we speak, today and tomorrow, and I’m sure our Prime Minister will raise the issue. I wonder, what are the countries in the NAC objecting to that, and what where are the negotiations heading, and if there were any initiatives on the part of Mr Rutte to break the impasse?
The second question has to do with the Southern front. Obviously, the war in Ukraine, with Russia, is the top priority, but there is a discomfort in the Mediterranean countries, that somehow the southern front does not take as big of a precedence. And it's not only the Mediterranean. We have trouble in the Red Sea. My country has been severely affected by the interruption of international trade and shipping lines through the Suez and the Red Sea. And I wonder what is the thinking in the headquarters about the situation there, and about, finally, the cooperation you talked about, many, many countries in our southern rim with the Republic of Cyprus. Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. Then we have Mimi Kodeli, head of delegation from Albania. Please, Mimi, you have the floor.
Mimi Kodeli, Albanian Delegation
Thank you. Almost 30 years from the Dayton Peace Agreement, the situation in the Western Balkans, hasn't changed so much. The KFOR [inaudible] NATO mission, results to be one of the most successful military peace keeping missions.
So my question is, do you think that we need some more decades to have a different panorama, more secure borders with non-members, or better, new NATO members from the Western Balkans? Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Thank you also, Mimi for this great question on the Balkans. Please. Mr Ruge, you have the floor.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Thank you very much. So, question from the Latvian delegation, for which many thanks, on military mobility. So when I was a conscript in the German military, in the Bundeswehr, during the Cold War, we had a different situation.
The sort of line of confrontation, if we want to call it, that was through the middle of Germany, so distances from the ports in the Netherlands were not so great. Today we face a situation where, in a situation of crisis or conflict, we would have to move large numbers of troops from the Dutch ports through Germany and Poland to the eastern flank.
It is a much more challenging situation for us, and it is very clear to SACEUR that this requires a great deal of attention. That is why we have made some changes, also in terms of the command structure, we are building the Joint Forces Command Norfolk, which has an important role, we have created the Joint Support and Enabling Command in Ulm, Germany, that is focused on enablement, and that includes military mobility.
So this is very much on the agenda. And this is an area where, of course, NATO and the EU have been working together and must continue to work together. When it comes to investments in infrastructure, bridges, roads, railroads, it seems to me that that we should, we should indeed make this EU-NATO cooperation happen and move forward.
And I think that is that is part of a conversation that is going on.
On the question from the Greek delegation, now, I think the answer to your question is that a number of nations feel that we have a series of work strands that are supported by existing units in the international staff, that address issues of democratic resilience.
So there's something called the building integrity agenda, which we have, obviously, we are very much engaged on issues of disinformation, misinformation. We sort of work on the southern neighbourhood, we work on issues of women, peace and security. We work on issues of media and media freedom across NATO Allies and so on. So I cannot talk to the concerns of individual Allies here. But it is, it is evident that we are not close to having consensus.
I think the Secretary General is well aware of the work that has been done here in the NATO Parliamentary Assembly. He is somebody who can try and bring about consensus. And that is essentially our job description. Every day, the Secretary General, and we who work for him in the international staff, are engaged in trying to bring about consensus at 32, but if it does not exist, we are limited in creating a new structure, in this case.
The southern front. I think what you were referring to was very much in the area of maritime security. Now, NATO could have played a role in this area. In the event, I think what we saw were ad hoc coalitions addressing the situation in the Red Sea, in the Gulf of Aden. And we also saw the European Union playing a role in that area. And I would not agree that the southern neighbourhood is not on the agenda. I think we take an important step forward with the southern neighbourhood action plan, with the appointment of a Special Representative. So I think it is very much on our radar.
As for Cyprus. I read this morning media reports about interest on the part of Cyprus, of developing relations with NATO. But the current state of play is that Cyprus is not a partner, and I have not, I myself have not heard from the Cypriots about any intentions in this regard.
And I believe the question from the Albanian delegation, for which many thanks, was about the Western Balkans, I can tell you that the Western Balkans is also very much on our radar. We are facing a situation in Bosnia that remains very difficult. We've had over the past year and a half, very difficult situations in Kosovo, including the attack on KFOR troops in May 2023 including the incident in Banjska in northern Kosovo in November 2023 and we have invested a lot of time and effort and resources in order to get a handle on that situation.
For example, we've added around about one thousand troops to KFOR to be able to deal with any situation that may arise. And we have, of course, reached out both to Belgrade and to Pristina to bring tensions down.
In Bosnia, we of course maintain our NATO Headquarters Sarajevo, led by US one star general. To that, we have added a political cell to have a better analysis of the political situation, to do a better job of reaching out to various communities in Bosnia and Herzegovina. And we are in close touch, of course, with EUFOR which, of course, as you know, remain supported by NATO, both in terms of the Berlin Plus arrangements and in terms of the shared reserves. So I can tell you that we are very much engaged. I myself have been in the recent months too, Pristina, Belgrade, Zagreb ,Podgorica and we've had a partnership symposium in Sarajevo with high level engagement as well.
So please, please be assured that that it has very much our attention and also the attention of SACEUR, of General Cavoli. Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. Then we go further with Hungary, acting head of delegation, Mr Nemeth, Zsolt Nemeth.
Zsolt Nemeth, acting Head of the Delegation of Hungary
Thank you very much. First of all, I would like to greet all of you dear colleagues in the name of the Hungarian National Assembly. Secondly, I would like to express my gratitude to Julie Dzerowicz, for these fantastic three days we had. Especially for yesterday evening, Julie, it was fantastic. Thank you very much. We enjoyed it extremely.
My question would be, Mr Ruge, Donald Trump. Donald Trump's victory is a great encouragement to us Hungarians, to terminate the Russian military aggression against the Ukraine. Ambassador Vershbow, your predecessor, two days ago, expressed his fears that Trump will throw Ukraine under the bus. Mr Deputy Secretary General, used these words. So Deputy Secretary General, I would like to ask your opinion. What is your expectation from the new US administration? Do you expect any change in the attitude of the United States towards the Russian aggression, towards the war in Ukraine? Thank you very much.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you very much. I was there. I didn't hear Mr Ambassador Vershbow saying that he will true. It was more like a philosophic question, but you were there as well. Türkiye, please Ms Tugba Isik Ercan, please, yes.
Tugba Isik Ercan, Delegation of Türkiye
Thank you very much. Mr Deputy Secretary General, given the persistent threat of terrorism to global security and its evolving tactics, as a representative from a nation that has experienced the severe impact of terrorism first-hand, I would like to ask, how does NATO plan to strengthen its counterterrorism efforts? How are Allies that have been at the forefront of countering terrorism being supported by NATO, and what steps are being taken for the Alliance's broader security strategy? And lastly, today is the International Day for the Elimination of Violence Against Women, and I'm very proud of many actions that have been taken in Türkiye to protect women against violation in the last two decades, and I would like to express my sincere hope for an end to all forms of violence globally, especially against women and children in Gaza, Lebanon and Ukraine. What are the special efforts of NATO, especially for women's security? Thank you very much.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you Ms Ercan, then we go to Finland. Mr Jarno Limnell, member of the Finnish delegation, yes, right.
Jarno Limnell, Delegation of Finland
Thank you very much, Mr Chair and Mr Deputy Secretary General. As we all know, the line between war and peace is blurring. Our Western societies face different kind of hybrid attacks on daily basis, and the methods of this hybrid influence are very wide. I could say that the imagination is the limit how these different kind of attacks are carried out. And at the moment, it seems that the spearheads for this kind of influencing are cyber-attacks, especially and information influencing. So my question is, how NATO is developing capabilities to defend itself, towards accelerating hybrid attacks and how NATO is building its deterrence as well as shared resilience in this field. Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you so much, Mr Ruge you have the floor, please.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Thank you very much. So the question of the Hungarian delegation was about a possible change in the attitude of the US government vis a vis Russia. As you know, Secretary General Mark Rutte paid a visit to President-elect Trump in Mar-a-Lago on Friday of last week, we have reached out to the President-elect and people around him, including people he has nominated for office in his incoming administration. We have done so in close coordination with the Biden administration, which, of course, is in office and is in charge until the 20th of January, and Secretary General Rutte, in his previous capacities, Prime Minister of Netherlands, has worked with President Trump during the first Trump administration. They know each other, and it was important for us to establish contact with President-elect Trump and his team at the earliest opportunity. Now I believe the US delegation would be best place, I think, to explain to you how they see the evolution and the articulation of the attitudes of President-elect Trump, who is obviously, as we speak, putting together his new team.
So I think it's too early to tell, but before I arrived here in Montreal, I spent half a day in Halifax. I heard from a number of members of the US Senate there who were very clear. That was Senator [Mike] Rounds, for example, very, very clear position on the need to support Ukraine in the face of Russian aggression. So I have, no evidence for the notion that President-elect Trump is going to take a completely different position that would be at odds with what 32 NATO Allies have decided on supporting Ukraine in its fight.
The question of the Turkish delegation was about counterterrorism, and that is an important topic, as all of you are well aware in the Strategic Concept of 2022 Russia is the main threat and the second threat that is identified in the Strategic Concept is indeed terrorism. And if you look at the Washington Declaration adopted by our heads of state and government, that is reflected in precisely those terms. Describing terrorism as the most direct asymmetric threat to NATO. And, of course, quite a few NATO Allies have experienced terrorist attacks. We have at NATO in the year 2023 designated a counterterrorism coordinator. That is my colleague Tom Goffus, Assistant Secretary General for Operations. We have updated the policy documents on counterterrorism in the run up to the Washington Summit. So we are very much engaged on this, and we will not take our eye off the ball and.
As for violence against women. We have also adopted an updated policy on Women, Peace and Security. We, of course, work primarily through the special representative of the Secretary General, Irene Fellin, in charge of Women, Peace and Security, as well as human security issues. So that too is on our agenda.
As for Finland. Let me say I had an excellent visit to Helsinki not long ago. With the security policy directors of 32 Allies, including a meeting with President Stubb and your Foreign Minister. And it was a very impressive visit also because it demonstrated the capabilities that Finland has not just in the military domain, but also in terms of resilience. And your approach to deal with the threats coming from Russia, and that, of course, includes cyber.
We have an upcoming event in London to deal with cyber. Cyber is very, very prominent. We all know that we have to do more and better in this regard. We are faced with adversaries who have significant capabilities. That includes Russia, certainly, but a number of NATO Allies have attributed attacks to China as well. And that, of course often targets civilian infrastructure, critical infrastructure.
We are definitely in the business of working with Allies, bringing together best practices and increasing our posture, getting better, thank you very much.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you, Mr Ruge. Then we have three more questions. Mr Mikko Savola from Finland. Please, Miko.
Mikko Savola, Delegation of Finland
Thank you, Mr Chair. Mr Deputy Secretary general. I'm here. And thank you for a speech and your answers.
Finland has been a NATO member for nearly two years now. From the outset, it was clear that we wanted to take the responsibility for our own security, contribute to collective security and be a good Ally.
We spent approximately 2.5 of our GDP on defence, and we plan to maintain this level and even increase it. Should we have a NATO consensus on the issue. In any case. The fair burden sharing is something that our American friends are waiting for us and for a very good reason.
Finland has supported Ukraine by providing 25 military aid packages and with humanitarian assistance, we will continue this support for as long as it is needed. We have also strengthened our defence industry. Within two years, we will produce about one third of all 155 millimetre artillery shells in Europe. Together. I underlined together.
We must enhance defence and interior. So, Mr Deputy Secretary General, my question is to you. How do you see the integration of Finland and Sweden in NATO So far? Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you, Mikko. Then we have Canada, Cheryl Gallant. Please, Cheryl.
Cheryl Gallant, Delegation of Canada: We go back to our parliaments and we raise this issue of inviting Ukraine into NATO with respect to issuing that invitation, what should our nations be considering in terms of the risks, both the costs and the threats of doing so, not doing so, or even waiting so much as two months.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Cheryl, then from Ukraine, acting head of delegation. Ms Bobrovska.
Solomiia Bobrovska, acting Head of the Delegation of Ukraine
Thank you, here on the left. First of all, I want to express, on behalf of all Ukrainian delegation, the gratitude to all of our friends and partners for raising the issues about Ukraine and an invitation to Ukraine. Finally, on the third full scale invasion, unprovoked and illegal, we hear that it's high time to say, "Welcome to Ukraine to the NATO family". We will insist, or will continue to convince, that invitation of Ukraine to NATO is the key political defeat of Russia, and that's probably the most significant contribution to your security.
My question will go with air defence shield. That's one of the requests which Ukraine asked couple months ago in order to start to shoot down the military Russian targets over the skies in Poland, Romania, because the only state now shooting down the military targets that's probably Belarus, without any permission, they just strike them. And the question is whether NATO is ready to help us to close the sky over the western regions in Ukraine, in order to give us a possibility to move our air defence to the most critical infrastructure, first of all, to Odessa region, in order to protect the grain corridor as well. Thank you.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you so much, Solomiia, for your great question. Mr Ruge, you have the floor please.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Thank you, Mr Vice President. To the question from the Finnish delegation. I think we are very pleased with how the integration of Finland and Sweden is proceeding, and I think we are stronger as an Alliance with you being part of our deterrence and defence, you have very capable military forces. Both Sweden and Finland have been partners of NATO for many years. So this was, I think, seamless is almost, I think, the correct adjective to describe how that's going. There's the element of command structures that's in the hand of SACEUR.
But I think, overall, it's an excellent picture, and and we've had the exercise, the artillery exercise, recently, so again, a very, very good picture. Hats off to Finland for everything you've done to prepare yourself and to contribute to our Alliance.
The question from the Canadian delegation, so we have discussed at NATO among 32 Allies and with Ukraine, of course, for the past years and with added urgency since the full scale invasion, the question of an invitation to Ukraine and the language from the Washington Summit, I think, is very clear, the position that 32 Allies have been able to agree on Ukraine's future as a NATO, the measures that we have taken in Washington, that is the long term pledge, that is the new command NSATU, constitute an irreversible bridge, constitute a bridge to Ukraine's membership. And Ukraine is on an irreversible path. So I think our leaders at 32 have decided that this is the direction of travel. The direction of travel is not a matter of debate.
The question is when we can move there, and the process of bringing a member into the Alliance is an elaborate process, and it must begin with consensus at 32. Now we can, we can talk about the risks, the costs of taking such a decision, and we must, that is due diligence. We must always keep in mind the risks and the costs of not doing so. And I think the view that our heads of state and government have taken repeatedly is that there is really no alternative in terms of lasting security for Ukraine but to bring them into the Alliance, because the track record of Russia is over the past 20 plus years, a very damning one. We can look at Russia's cease fires and peace agreements, for example, with Chechnya, we can look at the track record of the Minsk Agreements. As far as Russia is concerned, we can look at the lying, at the deception that Russia engaged in, and the run up to the full scale invasion.
So all of this, I think, suggests that faced with a major power such as Russia, which has demonstrated time and again its willingness to violate the most fundamental norms of international law and to sacrifice countless men, women and children, including its own soldiers, which are dying at absolutely astonishing levels every day in order to conquer territory that Mr Putin wishes to annex or has already annexed on paper. So the track record is not good, and in order to provide lasting security for Ukraine, the position that 32 Allies have taken is that Ukraine should be in NATO in the future, at a point to be defined when conditions are met. And that, of course, relates to reforms, and that relates to the situation on the ground in terms of the fighting.
To the Ukrainian delegation, we are, of course, well aware of the Ukrainian initiatives. I think the technical term is the humanitarian air defence shield, HADS. It is something that has been discussed in the NATO-Ukraine Council, President Zelensky has presented it. Your ministers have presented it. It has been debated at NATO, but it has not found consensus. There has not been consensus in NATO that we can engage in this type of support for Ukraine that would involve NATO shooting down missiles and drones over Ukrainian in airspace.
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you. Thank you very much. Then we go for the last group of three questions European Parliament. Head of delegation, Mr Salvatore de Meo, please.
Salvatore de Meo, European Parliament Delegation
Thank you, Chair. Thank you very much, Mr Deputy Secretary General, I appreciated your reference to Article Two of the Treaty, because quite often the political debate focuses on Article Five, when actually this Alliance goes beyond the military dimension, and it is important to strengthen our political and economic bonds, because the real strength of this Alliance are its relations, and not just the military component.
And therefore, your appeal, your plea to this Assembly, which is the expression of our democracies and our territories, you asked us to explain to the general public that we're facing a major challenge, which is that of creating a transatlantic defence system, which is, of course, a military defence, but it is first and foremost, a way of defending democracy, the EU and the NATO Alliance have common principles and values. Europe's motto is "united in diversity".
Therefore my question to you is, since you referred to the European pillar, how do you think that we can use the European Union, which represents 23 countries out of the 32 Allies, to foster this dialog, and given the fact that we've seen that there happened US elections, and other elections will happen in the future, how can we make sure that no result can have an impact on the values and challenges the Alliance faces?
Vice President NATO Parliamentary Assembly Vice President Theo Francken
Thank you signore De Meo. From Ukraine, former president of Ukraine, Mr Petro Poroshenko, please, you have the floor.
Petro Poroshenko, former President of Ukraine, President Poroshenko
Thank you very much indeed. Dear Chairman, dear Deputy Secretary, I think that we are now in the absolutely decisive day. Every single day, Ukraine is attacked by the Russian Iranian and Korean missiles. And only a few days ago, we received permission to lose long range missile against Russia. And every single night, we attacking the airfield, we destroying the air defence, and we providing the very encouraging situation that we can win this war. And with this situation, I think that we have a very encouraging words from the Bucharest Summit. We have a very encouraging words from the Vilnius Summit. We have a very encouraging words from the Washington summit that the door of NATO is open for Ukraine, please, if door is open, let us in. If you are not letting us in means door is closed, you are here representative of the people of the NATO membership nation, and we should send a very powerful message to the government, to your President and said that the opening door for NATO is in the favour in of your own security. And I have a very small question, if you think it is not possible that neighbouring NATO member states will attack the Russian missiles and Russian drones on Ukrainian territory, why doesn’t NATO allow Poland and other neighbouring states; major countries shoot down Russian, Iranian and North Korean drones and missiles over their own territory. This would help us a lot.
Boaz Bismuth, Head of the Delegation of Israel
Thank you very much. Mr Deputy Secretary general, my question. In fact, I will refer to the report. Excellent, very accurate report of yourself, Theo, head of the Belgian Delegation (Theo Franken). As we all know, Iran is one of the biggest threats to world stability. It funds proxy terrorist groups like Hamas, Hezbollah and Houthis, which threatens stability and maritime trade. Now, Hamas and Hezbollah have brought attacks on Israel from Gaza and Lebanon, which have obligated a self-defensive war. Iran also provides military support to Russia in its war against our Ukrainian friends, Iran's seeks nuclear warfare which can bring about nuclear race in the entire middle east and threaten western civilization. NATO, and we heard it yesterday again in the debates and also a few months ago in Rome, recognizes the Iranian threat. Now, my question would be very straightforward. Is NATO prepared to support diplomatic and even military action against Iran to curb its malign activity?
And also, I think that today it the international day for the elimination of violence against women and I think that one of the delegations here spoke about suffering of women, including in Gaza. But unfortunately, this delegation forgot to add that in Gaza right now for more than a year, you got 101 hostages including 13 women, including very young woman and I would have expected other delegations to mention those hostages and to do everything in our possibility, demanding everything to bring them back home.
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
To the question of the Italian delegation on EU-NATO cooperation, it is obviously fundamental. I think you are all aware of the work that has been done over the years. But I can tell you that Secretary General Rutte as a new Secretary General with 14 years of experience working in the European Council, with a familiarity with the European institutions, is very well placed, I think, to maximize this cooperation, and he has, of course, reached out to the President of the Commission. He has reached out to the Designated High Representative/Vice President for Common Foreign and Security Policy and other designated commissioners who I believe will be in place very soon on the 1 December if I'm not mistaken.
So, we will do the maximum to work with the European Union. I don't want to go over sort of the mechanisms that exist and that you are all aware of but I would like to mention the meeting that took place on the 19 November in Warsaw between 6 foreign ministers, Poland, Germany, France, Italy, Spain and UK which produced a statement that I would recommend to all of your attention because it talks specifically about the need for European Allies to step up, to put their money where their mouth is, so to speak and to resource our deterrence and defence at the level that is required today. It also talks about the role that the European Union might play, and it talks about innovative approaches and of course we do have proposals on the table that deserve attention.
For example, the Polish-Greek proposal on air defence, we have consideration on the European side of using unspent money from the cohesion funds in order to support deterrence and defence related projects. So, I think there's something happening here. For us at NATO what is important is two things: Number one, NATO is and should remain the framework for our collective defence. So, what is done in terms of mobilizing resources, possibly on the EU side, when it comes to deterrence and defence, collective defence, it must come to bear, must be brought to bear in the NATO framework. And secondly, we will always watch out for our non-EU NATO Allies and to make sure that they are included in all efforts to the maximum extent.
On the question from President Poroshenko, well noted. It is decisive days, I know that you are impatient, I know that people in Ukraine are impatient. I think all of us in this room realize that the people of Ukraine are under massive pressure. We admire the courage, the resilience with which you have managed to stay in this fight. On the part of NATO, we have provided unprecedented support. But we do not believe that resting on that is enough. We have to look at what is needed in this situation and, what is needed is, on the one hand, to continue to support Ukraine with the military equipment and with the financial support that it needs to stay into the fight. And we also understand that the political perspective of Ukraine joining NATO is extremely important. That will happen when 32 NATO Allies come together and take the necessary steps. I imagine this is not the answer that you're looking for, but I know that Ukrainians understand NATO.
You are at the table in the NATO-Ukraine Council. We use it a great deal. We are talking to each other in ways that take our cooperation to a new level. We have a NATO representation in Ukraine headed by a senior official, staffed by a large number of international staff and Ukrainian local staff. That puts us in a position of better cooperation. So, we will move all these things forward and our heads of state government will tell us when the time arrives, when we can take that decisive step. But the decision that has been taken is that the future of Ukraine is in NATO and just a remind of what Secretary General Rutte said in his video statement, security of Ukraine is our security, and we are very much aware of that.
Shooting down sort of missiles, I've talked about the humanitarian air defence shield proposal that has been put on the table. That has not been followed up by NATO because there's no consensus to do so. When it comes to missiles, drones, cruise missiles that enter Allied airspace, that’s a different question. And, of course, NATO Allies are well within their rights to shoot down any such objects that violate their airspace, and they are ready to do so, and collectively we are ready to defend against such incursions.
To our Israeli colleague, the Israeli delegation, it is perfectly clear to us that what Iran is doing is destabilizing, not just the Middle East and North Africa, but also affecting Euro-Atlantic security. The Iranian nuclear program is definitely on our radar and Iran taking on a role as a supporter of Russia's war of aggression is also on our agenda. So, Iran is an increasing problem, not just for the region, but for us, and we will reach out and work with partners to seek ways to address this as it affects our security. And, of course, the hostages that remain in the hands of Hamas are very much on our minds. They are not forgotten and we hope to see an end to the fighting. So that people in Israel and people in Gaza and people in Lebanon, civilians, are not affected by this fighting. They have all our sympathy and we hope to see an end to this fighting soon.
Marie-Agnes Strack-Zimmermann, European Parliament Delegation, Chairwoman Defence Committee in the European Parliament
Thank you so much, Mr Ruge, for these highly interesting remarks. I'd like to refer to the situation in Ukraine once again. What we've seen is that. 10,000, 12,000 North Korean soldiers have come to the theatre, and the North Korean foreign minister had announced that he had no problem sending more soldiers, and we all know that North Korea, alongside with China and the United States, have the biggest landing army. At the same time, we are witness to Russia trying to recruit the Houthis of Yemen to fight in Ukraine. Does that mean that Russia wants to spare their own soldiers, but recruit soldiers of other nations, providing them in return with military power and technology to be used in the Red Sea?
So, my question goes out to you, the entire Indo-Pacific, I mean, North Korea also touches upon Japan, the Philippines, entire Indo-Pacific is also on fire now. And my question to you is whether there are plans of NATO to work more intensely in the Indo-Pacific. There were plans to set up an office in Japan, if I remember correctly, because the war in Ukraine is not just a conflict pertaining to one territory, but it has worldwide repercussions.
Martins Stakis, European Parliament Delegation
How many votes are in favour to send an invitation for Ukraine to be a member of NATO, and who is against?
Acting NATO Deputy Secretary General Boris Ruge
Let me start with the last question. We operate on the basis of consensus, we don’t vote. And the answer, therefore, is that we need 32 Allies to support an invitation to Ukraine for this process of accession to start.
To answer the question put by Chairwoman Strack-Zimmermann. It's very good to see you here and your role as the Chairperson of the newly established Defence Committee in the European Parliament. I think it is a very important one and we look forward to working with you and your colleagues. Now, indeed, the presence of North Korean soldiers in Russia, fighting alongside Russian troops is truly remarkable, something that many of us would not have imagined. I have seen the press reports about Russia recruiting Yemeni soldiers. Russia, according to our assessment, is losing large numbers of soldiers killed or wounded each and every day and it is now bringing in mercenaries, if you like, and I don't imagine that these mercenaries will be treated any better than Russian soldiers. Possibly they will be even more cannon fodder than the Russian infantrymen that are being sent out and being killed in large numbers every day and, indeed one concerning aspect of this is that ascending North Korean troops is not a one-way street. There's a two-way street here and Russia is supplying technology to North Korea in return, and we could speculate about what Russia is doing for the Houthis in Yemen in order to generate this kind of manpower for its war.
We have responded to this by stepping up, when it comes to, certainly to the DPRK, further stepping up our work with our IP4 partners. As you know, the heads of state and government of the IP4 have been present at three NATO Summits in a row. Just a few weeks ago, for the first time, we had the Defence Ministers of Australia, Japan, New Zealand and the Republic of Korea present at a Defence Ministerial Meeting. We had a senior South Korean intelligence official briefing NATO ambassador shortly after the announcement of the deployment of North Korean troops was made. So, we are definitely building those relationships, because as we can see, these are issues of global security. Euro-Atlantic theatre and the Indo-Pacific theatre are more connected than they have been as a result of this Russian war of aggression, and we respond to that by intensifying our cooperation with the IP4.
The issue of a liaison office in Tokyo is currently not on the agenda. But there are many, many work strands that we have with the IP4, including a shared agenda on security, including annual high-level staff talks. I myself will go to Australia in 10 days’ time and we have the same exercise with the South Koreans, with the Japanese as well.
So, to conclude, in this day and age where obviously security has this global dimension, we will intensify our work with partners in the Indo-Pacific, in the Southern Neighbourhood and in other parts of the world to protect our 1 billion citizens. Thank you very much.