IFOR AFSOUTH TRANSCRIPT Sept 18, 1996

In the interest of speed transcripts of IFOR press briefings are issued in unedited format Transcript of the press Briefing held on 18 September 1996

Agi Kuperman: good morning ladies and gentlemen. The final results will be announced by the Ambassador. We don't yet know exactly when but relatively soon. I would suspect slightly after noon, early afternoon I think, we will get final results. In the mean time I thought I would just give you preliminary results with the caveat that these have not had the chance to be evaluated. It has to go through the normal process of validating, and that will take place soon. I will also tell you something about spoiled ballots, but I thought you should know what we know thus far. The following are the counts as of 09:30: from the federation 86 out of 89 counting centres. From the Republika Srpska 59 out of 61 counting centres. Only five have not come in with results, 2 from the repblika Srpska and 3 from the federation. The counting centres that have not come in are the following: Bosanski Petrovac, Prijedor, Bosanska Dubica, Velika Kladusa and Travnik. The numbers are: Izetbegovic - 699,586 Silajdzic - 121,253 Zubak - 331,133 Krajisnik - 631,767 Ivanic -282,985 The total number of votes counted in the federation is 1,220,354. In the Republika Srpska 938,500. If I counted correctly that is total of 2,106.000 and that is about 75% of 2.9 million. That is the latest figures I have, and I said that these are not validated results, these are just preliminary. They have to go through the normal process that every election goes through - of validating results. The Ambassador will have the final results. On spoiled ballots: the total number of spoiled ballots for the federation are 3.73% and with the Republika Srpska 6.95%. Thank you. Brett... Maj. Boudreau: thank you. Good morning. Unfortunately, I must begin with two pieces of sad news this morning. Firstly, a Romanian engineer was killed late yesterday morning while working on the Gorazde access track near Delijas, when the excavator he was driving tipped and fell from the road into a ravine. While this accident and the road accident on Monday which claimed the life of a French warrant officer are unconnected, they are a grim reminder of how dangerous it can be simply to work and drive here in Bosnia. While we do not think any additional instructions or planning could have prevented these incidents, Lt. Gen. Sir Michael Walker, commander of the ARRC, has issued a reminder to his divisional commanders to remain vigilant to all sources of accidents within IFOR's daily assignments, as well as to the obvious threats from outside our own units. Secondly, a young British soldier beaten up in Split by local youths on September 7 died of his injuries in the hospital yesterday in the UK. General Walker extends his condolences to the family and friends of the soldiers. In the further developments today on the serious incident involving the Prijedor chief of police Simo Drljaca. We are demanding the removal of Mr. Drljaca and are working with the IPTF and the rest of the international community to bring that about through the appropriate means. Our investigation of the facts of the latest incident illustrated his unfitness to hold that office. Essentially, he was in possession of an illegal weapon in his car without a proper permit. He refused to hand over the weapon. He threatened IFOR soldiers by pointing the weapon at them and firing into the air. And finally, he ordered some of his policemen to intervene with illegal long-barrelled weapons. The situation was defused by the steadfast actions of the Czech patrol, who stood their ground until the police chief ordered his officers to withdraw and agreed to cooperate in a complete investigation of the incident by IFOR and the IPTF, which, of course, monitors police conduct throughout Bosnia with IFOR's support. Mr. Drljaca's actions represent contempt of the Dayton Accord and his behaviour on this and earlier occasions has made his removal mandatory. On the elections support front, across every divisional area today, our work of patrolling in the area of operations and the counting houses, monitoring the movement of OSCE personnel, and the transport of counted ballots to the OSCE central warehouse in Rajlovac continues without incident. Finally, the railroad bridge in MND North's area just West of the town of Brcko, which was badly damaged during the war, will be demolished starting today to clear the way for a replacement bridge. American engineers will be in charge of that, with a civilian contractor handling the clean-up.

And just a couple of church notices; first, I would remind you of the media opportunity at Sarajevo airport today at 13:15 with Defence Ministers Ruehle and Portillo. There is a list posted on the notice board of all those journalists who are on the press facility today. Captain Betty Dorson is organising that trip and please contact her if there are any changes to be made to the list. There is also an announcement from the World Health Organisation in the foyer with respect to a joint statement by the Ministers of Health and an American Bar Association press release with respect to the federation supreme court inauguration on 18 September, and those are, once again, in the foyer. Thank you. A. Ivanko: today the Police Commissioner Peter Fitzgerald is meeting with the Republika Srpska Minister of Interior, Dragan Kijec. He will demand the dismissal of Simo Drljaca from his position of chief of police of Prijedor. To put things in perspective, the NGO Human Rights Watch came up with the list which is called "abusive police officials still on the post" and this list is lead by Simo Drljaca and this is what the report says: "The chief of police of Prijedor is one of the most notorious police officials in the whole of former Yugoslavia. He controlled the civil police and special police forces during the Serb take over of the Prijedor area. He was directly involved in setting up the infamous camps around Prijedor. So we believe enough is enough. He should probably call it today and retire." On another issue, some of you remember the problems we had with the Finnish team Collecting remains in the area of Kravice. As you know the Office of the High Representative has, as we understand, sorted this out and yesterday IPTF escorted a team of Bosnian forensics experts to that area. The team was headed by the BH Chairman of the Committee for Exchange of Prisoners Amor Masovic and they started work yesterday in Kravica. They have collected, as far as I understand, the remains of 20 people. And also in that area the head of the Serb Commission Dragan Bulajic was also present. Security was being conducted in the local police. There were absolutely no incidents; everything went well and the Bosnian team left the area and will continue work in the next week. That is all I have. Thank you. K. Janowski: from UNHCR we have an update on the pilot projects which as you know involves four cities in central Bosnia and Herzegovina: Jajce, Bugojno, Travnik and Stolac. In Jajce, the project was completed yesterday with 202 families actually being allowed to return. This however does not complete the entire project. In Stolac there has been a bit of a breakthrough with the people recently being able to actually go to Stolac and work on the repair of their houses. These are Muslims who are supposed to come back to Stolac. The atmosphere while they work there is much better than it used to be. They used to be confined to one street and essentially held in sort of reconstruction ghetto. Now they can wonder around the city, and generally the atmosphere is more conducive to return. None of them have returned so far. In Bugojno the project has been completed half way with about 98 families returning. But, unfortunately in Bugojno tension rose after a Croat man whose name is Stjepan Vukadin who lived in Bugojno throughout the war, who was part of the implementation of the Dayton pilot project and also member of the Local Election Commission. This man's house was blown up on the eve of the election day, on late Friday while the entire family that is - he, his wife and two children were watching television in the living room. The explosive device was placed outside the window and the family are convinced that whoever planted the bomb w as trying, not only to destroy the house, but actually to kill them, since they were clearly seen sitting in the living room and we also tent to believe that whoever tried to damage the house was also trying to hurt the people since it was obvious that they would have been hurt and it was virtually a miracle that they all survived without any major injuries. We have written to the mayor of Bugojno, Mr. Dzevad Mlaco who has a bit of a record and he is actually considered by us the one of the least cooperative officials in the entire territory of BIH. And we are holding Mr. Mlaco personally responsible for the safety of Mr. Vukadin and other Croats who have returned to Bugojno of who have lived there throughout the war. Thank you. M. Maclay: good morning. I told you yesterday that Mr. Bildt was aiming to make a statement on the transition as soon as we had all of the results or enough results of the presidentials for him to be able to address here. I am afraid we haven't quite reach that moment, but we are very conscience that many of you are leaving today. So we will be in touch with the CPIC and Skenderija in the case that is easier with details of any press conference we are able to set up in the course of the day. The only difficulty will be that Mr. Bildt is in intensive contact with the leading candidates as you can imagine. He will be seeing each of the three leading presidential candidates in the course of the day and the timing has not been firmed up in each case because, as you know, the charm of a democratic race, however imperfect, is one doesn't really know till it is over, exactly what the result is, and he is obviously watching this final results very carefully. He will aim to speak to you later on the day. Thank you very much. A. Kuperman: Mr. Seagal of the Commission of Real Property Claims of Displaced Persons and Refugees will make a statement and he will take questions later after the briefing. S. Seagl: thank you. My name is Steven Seagal and I am the Executive Officer for the Commission for Real Property Claims of Displaced Persons and Refugees. Annex 7 of the Dayton Agreement gives the property commission authority to receive and decide claims for real property through Bosnia and Herzegovina. Any person who has lost possession of their property other than through a truly voluntary transaction may apply to the commission. The commission is made up of nine commissioners selected by the European Court of Human Rights, the republic of Srpska and the federation. The commission's decisions are final. Any certificate of title issued by the commission must be recognised as lawful throughout BIH as mandated in the Dayton Agreement. The elections we in the international community have witnessed over this weekend were necessary step on the very long road that will take generations for peace and reconciliation. What four years of war has created cannot be eliminated in a few months by elections. More than elections are required, and that is one of the reasons the property commission exists. Why does the property commission exist? I will try to address very briefly. Number one: the reintegration of Bosnian society, a multhietnic Bosnia is depended upon the resolution of property issues. All of you are aware of the results of violent programmes of ethnic cleansing which drove entire communities from their homes. Illegally taken property titled away from innocent property owners was one of the major weapons with which ethnic cleansing was accomplished. Each success of the property commission of restoring property to its rightful owner will be a step on the long road back to the multiethnic Bosnia. The second reason the work of the commission is so critical is that the property commission will provide a sound basis for reconstruction. As the international community is now beginning to provide funds to repair houses, who is to confer ownership on this houses. The international agencies or municipality authorities have the capacity to establish the basis of property title. If there is no clearly thought out mechanism to resolve ownership, every new housing unit that is made available becomes a source of future confusion, a source of future conflict. The third reason the commission is so essential to the success of the peaceful Bosnia is that the work of the property commission is closely linked to repatriation of refugees from abroad. Across the capitals of host countries there is wide spread disappointment at the very slow progress of repat riation. It is clear that before voluntary returns can begin on a significant scale, the refugee population must be convinced that the conditions exist in Bosnia to resume a normal life. Part of the normalisation process is property. Every refugee wants to know: "Do I get my house back?" If not will I get compensation? And those issues weigh heavy in their decision to return. The commission will go directly to the refugees abroad to receive their property claims. As the refugees learn that there is a formal mechanism which offers the possibility of return to their homes and their businesses or perhaps of compensation in lieu of return, the level of confidence among refugees as to the future of life in this country will gradually increase. The final reason the work of the commission is so critical is that the property commission will help to stabilise economic conditions. Without the definitive and reliable property title system, businesses cannot move ahead with confidence. Even without the war, the Bosnian economy's ability to move out of the communist system would be in a difficult transition period. Now after four and a half years of war and aftermath conflict which left communities and industries in ruins, all property transactions, whether leases or purchases are hampered by the uncertainty surrounding property title. Details about exactly how the property commission are available with the lady in the read outfit over there, Carmen would you raise your hand. And if you want any information on that, she has a handout that she can give you. Thank you. A. Kuperman: we'll take questions now. Q: question for Agi in two parts; number one is - could those two remaining RS counting stations count up to 60.000 people? The second part in another words - in the case that those votes are found valid, would you say that there are no more chance for Krajisnik to catch up with President Izetbegovic? A. Kuperman: I am not going to speculate on any final results. As I said, the count that I gave you are preliminary and they are not validated. So I cannot comment any further on that. Q: the first part of the question is not comment. Could two counting stations count up to 60.000 people? Agi Kuperman: I really don't know how many each of those counting stations have as voters. Q: Mike, what impact do you think this rather startlingly positive showing by the socialists in Republika Srpska will have on political balance there? What kind of problems does that pose for Krajisnik and for the Split between East and West areas of Republika Srpska? M. Maclay: David I think in the first instance it is worth seeing as an opportunity - an opportunity for the beginnings of pluralism. We haven't yet seen any results other than the presidentials, but it is a promising signal that some people in the Republika Srpska are looking for another way. It is not for us to take a view on any of the candidates in this election, but what we must welcome is something less than monolithic. I think that the elections we have yet to see the results of might be more important in giving some suggestion of what the likely party structures are going to be in the future and how much the pluralism will play not through a personal vote where two coalitions backed a rather impressive candidate from Banja Luka, but when we see village by village and municipality by municipality. I am not sure you are right about the East-West Split being quite that crass(?) But we have got to see the results before we take a view on that. Q: certainly throughout the Summer Karl Bildt made a major part of his emphasis the support for these particular people, and now you do have a positive result. How much credit do you take for that, and do you think that Karl Bildt will be meeting with these people up there to continue to show his support, even after the elections? M. Macley: I don't think we would seek any sort of credit. There is a strong school of thought that any sort of external... Anything that can be portrayed as an external interference in local politics is going to be counterproductive, I should think. This has a lot more to do with the man in question being a strong candidate from Banja Luka who had a rather non-political background but a big personal appeal. How much it was negative voting against something else again we are not qualified to speak to but in the weeks ahead we will obviously intensify the links that we already have with the range of political parties in RS. A. Kuperman: I might just mention that at Skenderija we are beginning to post the other results as they come in, for assembly and cantonal voting. Q: you give us the number of votes for each candidate. Do you have it in percentage points as they usually be also in Skenderija, for these latest figures? You gave us the number of votes that each candidate each candidate get. Do you have it in percentage points? A. Kuperman: I don't have it here. These were the latest as I got them on my way. You can check Skenderija, they will have them for you. Q: three very quick questions, so please bear with me; to Mr. Janowski: could you tell me is there ongoing investigation to determine the origin of that bombing and if any sanctions have been discussed similar to other sanctions that have been discussing in the other problem areas. Sorry. To the gentleman refereed to as Mike, but who I don't know and I don't know what. I can't believe that you still don't have name tags, gentleman and madam. But gentleman refereed to as Mike. M. Maclay: I am Michael Maclay, spokeman for Carl Bildt if anyone asks. Q: O.K. Thank you. The question to you. In the corollary to the situation with what you described as increasing pluralism in Republika Srpska. Mcclay: the beginnings of... Q: the beginning of the pluralism. Could you comment please on the surprisingly low showing by Mister Silajdzic and do you think it is continuing lack of pluralism in the Moslem part of federation? And finally a question to Mr. Ivanko. My question to you is: following up on the old question of where alleged innocent till proof guilty war criminals May be voting. Where has Dario Kordic voted and do you have any information about his voting and if not why not? K. Janowski: my name is Chris Janowski, I am the spokesman for the UNHCR. Yea, there was an investigation by the local police in Bugojno which I understand is also watched by the IPTF. I mean Alex will be able to confirm that. I don' t think the investigation has been completed. But as I said we do hold... Ultimately we do hold the mayor responsible for the safety of the minorities in Bugojno. Q: no potential sanctions under discussion. K. Janowski: well, if we had been imposing sanctions after every bomb planted in Bosnia-Herzegovina against the minorities we would have been out of here four years ago. Q: (inaudible) K. Janowski: no, no it is only half way. Q: so there is no way of going to Bugojno. So he's under sanctions already. K. Janowski: yeah, but I mean sanctions over the pilot project. In the Stolac the pilot project is still stuck. So and it's been now ten months old so we're not... Our approach to the pilot project is not imposing sanctions because otherwise, we would be out of it a long time ago. Michael Maclay, M-a-c-l-a-y, office of the High Representative. Pluralism on the federation side - it's not for us to take a view on the results, I would said having read carefully Mr. Van Thijn's report and from our own monitoring of the campaign that was more of a problem on the RS side with access to media and freedom of expression so that makes Mr. Ivanic's achievement I think all the greater. On this side, one has to say there was a greater degree of access. The state television permitted more pluralism of views, and I don't think that our concerns on this side went quite as deep a s they did on the RS side. That is not to give a federation side completely bill of health particularly in the area of Herzeg-Bosna, as we all understand. But, there was a sort of structure pluralism with the number of capable parties well entrenched in a very lively debate. And to that extent I don't think our concerns about pluralism on this side were quite wide ranging as on the other. Alex Ivanko: my full name UN Russian is Aleksandar Sergejevic Ivanko. I'm the UN spokesman here and I've tried to track down where Dario Kordic voted. Couldn't. Why? Beats me, nobody seems to know. Agi Kuperman: maybe I should tell you my name. My good Hungarian name is Agota, but everybody calls me Agi Kuperman and I'm the spokesperson for OSCE. David. Q: Agi, or sorry, Alex, what's your track record on forcing resignations? A. Ivanko: pretty patchy, we had some successes specifically with the chief of police of Teslic, the deputy chief of police of West Mostar, the chief of operations of Doboj, a number of others. We also had a few misses. We hope we'll be successful with the chief of police of Prijedor, but on the other hand we do understand he is a good chum of Minister Kijac so it's going to be difficult one. Q: and if I could ask a different question to Kris Janowski. German leaders of the German state, or the senior officials connected with the 400,000 refugees there are meeting to decide a date when they should all be sent back. Do you have any sort of comment what the UNHCR position on the idea of sending these people back sooner rather then later? K. Janowski: well the UNHCR position is essentially remains unchanged, in the sense that at the moment obviously no conditions for these people to be sent back. Most the refugees now in Germany come from Republika Srpska , most of them are Moslems and Croats, and in Republika Srpska at the moment , obviously there are no conditions for these people to go back. As you know, since Dayton we have evacuated a 146 people from Republika Srpska. Many of them have been evacuated because it could have been unsafe for them to remain there. And the attitude towards minorities remains unchanged. In most cases in fact, the reasons why those people those areas are still there, so sending them back at the moment would be totally premature. Q: Nigel (?) For focus. Except for the fact that there is... The Serbs stopped counting for a few hours on Sunday the votes. Why does it take so long, why does the counting process take so long? Can you give us some other reasons or are there any other reasons, except for the fact that they stopped counting on Sunday for a few hours? A. Kuperman: I mentioned to you that there are five places still that have not sent us results. Part of the reason is that in some places they do not count over night, so there is a gap between the counting from last evening till this morning in some places. That's basically the reason. There is no politically motivated reason; it's just a slowness of the process in certain areas. Now, in some cases, and we have some counting stations where they have finished. So, it's just a kind of disproportionate number of counting stations are faster and some slower. Q: can you tell, can you answer me one more question. In... I heard that in some places of the Republika Srpska, there is more then 100% of voters, how do you say participation. Can you name the places exactly. I heard it's Brcko, I heard it's Srebrenica? A. Kuperman: we don't have any information on that yet. We will look into any kind of allegations of impropriety and voting in the validation process. Yes, Colin. No, sorry the other one. Q: it doesn't happen very often. I know it's bit early for this and that we're not clear in the size of the electorate but is the ratio of votes counted between the entities consistent with what you might have expected? We've got a couple of large communities in area that has not voted yet, so it looks like 1.1 or 1. 2 to one ratio. A. Kuperman: I'd rather not speculate on what might be the final results or what we have expected. We are pleased that the process is going on and the counting is taking place in very orderly fashion. Q: related to this early question about the turnout. The figures that Ambassador Frowick gave yesterday for the Serb voters or the electorate was about a million. And with these incomplete results, we almost have a million on the presidency bounce already. Do you, could you , would you wish to comment on that? And just give us more... You said you were gonna look into this if there has been any ballot stuffing, but I mean these statistics that you give us already seem to indicate incredibly high turnout for the Serb electorate. A. Kuperman: well, on ballot stuffing, of course the subcommission will look into any kind of problems that come up, any kind of appeal, complaints. On the turnout, I would suggest you that one reason why there is good turn out is that the Republika Srpska was far more organized for elections. But further comments -- I think we have to wait 'till we have the Election Appeals Subcommission's results. Q: do you, you said that you need a specific request to investigate, you're not gonna look into it on your own... I mean because your eyebrows are raised about it. Do you have to have a specific complaint about that? A. Kuperman: I think the Appeals Subcommission is looking into that as well. As you know that for the counting they have another 72 hours to receive all complaint and appeals to them. Q: Michael is there a time table for this planned first informal meeting of the three members of the presidency? Is issue of venue still a problem? M. Maclay: not yet, we haven't got to those discussions yet. Mr. Bildt will be in touch with each of the leading candidates separately in the course of today. Q: a question for Mike. Maria Helleman, NOS TV Holland. Yesterday, you couldn't elaborate on the legal steps Mr. Van Thijn asked at Bildt's office and the PEC. I know there have been contacts between Bildt's office and Van Thijn's office, and Van Thijn told me yesterday you exactly know what he is asking as the legal steps against the SDS. Could you elaborate on it today? M. Mcclay: I regret I wasn't party to those conversations. Was this at experts, legal experts level or what? Q: no, the steps towards the SDS because of the secession rhetoric during the campaign? M. Maclay: yeah, oh sure, I know what you're talking about. I'm very interested as I said yesterday to know. I apologize that I'm not briefed, do come back to me in the course of the day and I'll find out who in our mission is aware. What he said at the press conference was a little ambiguous. And we need to discover exactly what he means. Q: Agi, I know it's a recurring question , but do you have any idea why so many ballots were spoiled on both sides? Spoiled ballots? A. Kuperman: no, I really don't know. I think there may be some of it attributed to confusion, but, I really don't know. I haven't seen this spoiled ballots myself. They're probably fallen to several different categories as they were counted. They were declared spoiled. Q: and sorry, I just have a second question. Does the subcommission look into cases where there is not a formal complaint? A. Kuperman: Generally complaints come either to the PEC or to the Appeals Sub-Commission. I myself have received two complaints from journalists, and I submitted it to them. So it's a variety of sources that complaints can be lodged, but of course, if no complaints are lodged then it cannot investigate something. Q: Agi, if the race turns up to be between Krajisnik and Izetbegovic, turns out to be as close as it looks now, it appears it may even get closer before the day is out, there'll probably be a cause for a re-count. What is the OSCE's procedure for a re-count of votes? A. Kuperman: I don't think we thought about that, that far, because we are quite confident that we will have final results today. If those are questioned then we will take into account what steps to take next. Q: are you saying you don't have any formal procedure, even prepared for a re-count? A. Kuperman: I'm saying I am not aware of discussions of re-count. There may be formal procedures that I don't know of. But I don't think there's any discussion at this point of re-count. Q: yeah, this is a question for Agi. Lion Mandale Pacifica. I wanted to ask about of the 14,700 refugees that crossed the boundary and voted in these elections. Have all but the man who is beat up in Prijedor returned back and in safety and are they okay? A. Kuperman: we have had report from all of our regional centers, and there were no other incidents noted on any of the 14,700. Q: John Bosnic again, Intermedia Center, Radio Japan. A question to Miss Kuperman about the apparent discrepancy or great difference in the number of spoiled ballots. It seems, if I understood your figures correctly, that the number of spoiled ballots in Republika Srpska side was almost double or approaching double the number of spoiled ballots on the federation side. I know you may not have the time to analyze reason for that but, could you give us any indication of what you might be thinking is the cause of that doubling of spoiled ballots on one side of common election? A. Kuperman: you're absolutely right. None of us have had time you analyze these results. We are counting madly and we're all running around trying to find the correct information. We will do so as soon as we have a little respite from the actual results gathering, so the best I can give you is a breakdown. I have it here after the conference; you're welcome to make copies by municipalities - by counting centers and maybe you can analyze them faster then we can. Q: a question for Major Boudreau, from IFOR, concerning the Prijedor affair. I would like to know exactly the legal ground for the IFOR action. I'm posing this question because obviously, one single automatic rifle or weapon was not a threat neither for IFOR nor for the other side. Therefore, as far as I have understood, Annex 1A, article 6, number 6 is the regulation which gives IFOR the right to observe to monitor and to inspect every forces which seems necessary to IFOR. But, not to take away single guns. Maj. Boudreau: in fact I think if you read further in that same paragraph you will note that IFOR is obligated and entitled to take actions against threats to itself and in this case the chief of police pointed and cocked the weapon at the IFOR soldiers, therefore we will take whatever actions are required to remove that threat to our person. Q: May I continue? Maj. Boudreau: yes. Q: do you really believe that a single weapon behind in a car is a threat to IFOR? Maj. Boudreau: I have seen what damage weapons can do to people, and I do believe that a single automatic weapon pointed at a soldier and potentially fired at a soldier is a threat. Therefore the soldiers acted appropriately, and in fact, if we can be frank about it, the chief of police was lucky to get out alive. The Czech soldiers would have been fully within their rights to fire in their own defense, when they realized that there is a weapon being leveled against them. Q: I agree with you perfectly when the action started of course the rifle became dangerous. But, the question whether if the rifle in the (...)